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Cassim's June 26 testimony

MR CASSIM: I'm going to be very honest with you, they were just talking about the pitches. Hansie will tell him, 'Probably the score will be - we can go to about 220, 230'.

MS BATOHI: Which pitch was he referring to?

MR CASSIM: I assume he was referring to the King's Park pitch.

MS BATOHI: Why do you assume that?

MR CASSIM: Because I think that's what Sanjay asked him, that - because that was the next match.

MS BATOHI: What did Sanjay ask him about the next match?

MR CASSIM: To say what do you think the scores would be at this match, and how would the pitch be and which team was going to play.

MS BATOHI: Which team was going to play? Surely - are you talking about who was going to be in the team?

MR CASSIM: Sorry, who was going to be in the team. That's correct.

MS BATOHI: "Sanjay was asking him about the pitch conditions and what the possible scores could be the next day." That would have been the match between South Africa and Zimbabwe, is that correct?

MR CASSIM: I think so.

MS BATOHI: And what did they say about team selection?

MR CASSIM: I just can't remember what they said about team selections.

MS BATOHI: Why can't you remember that, Mr Cassim?

MR CASSIM: It's very difficult for me to remember all those things, Adv Batohi, because I know it might have been a 10 minute conversation - I was watching the cricket match and I wasn't really interested in what they were saying, but from the outset I could just hear the few things that they were discussing.

MS BATOHI: No, no, Mr Cassim. You know exactly what went on in that conversation, and I'm going to tell you why I put that to you. You've now told us that they were talking about the match the following day, which was South Africa and Zimbabwe, they were talking about what the possible total scores could be, they were talking about the pitch at Kingsmead. Is that correct?

MR CASSIM: Probably correct, ja.

MS BATOHI: Not possibly correct, Mr Cassim ...(intervention)

MR CASSIM: That would be correct.

MS BATOHI: That is your testimony. Is that correct?

MR CASSIM: Correct.

MS BATOHI: You also say in your statement they were talking about 'the conditions upon winning the toss.' What were they saying about that?

MR CASSIM: I can't actually recall properly. I think Sanjay could have asked Hansie, 'If you win the toss will you bat, or will you lose?'

MS BATOHI: Sorry, I don't want to know what he could have asked him. Well, what did he ask him? Did he ask him what he would do if he won or lost the - if he won the toss?

MR CASSIM: I don't recall.

MS BATOHI: What do you mean in your statement when you say 'they spoke about conditions upon winning the toss'?

MR CASSIM: Probably they were just discussing the condition of the pitches.

MS BATOHI: No, I'm sure that conditions upon winning the toss doesn't have anything to do with the pitches. It may in some indirect way, but you explain that to us, what were they - you were listening to - you were there, Mr Cassim, although you say you weren't listening intently to what they were saying, but you were there and you heard them talking about the conditions upon winning the toss. That's in your statement. Now what were they saying about that?

MR CASSIM: I presume Sanjay could have asked Hansie ...(intervention)

MS BATOHI: Sorry, Mr Cassim. You start you statements with 'I presume he could have'. I don't want any presumptions about what could have happened or what he could he have said. I want you to tell us what you heard him say, or them say about the conditions upon winning the toss.

MR CASSIM: I don't recall what they were discussing to do with - about winning the toss. I just can't remember, but I know they were talking of winning the toss, they were talking of pitches, they were talking of runs, and me not being a betting man, I never knew what they were discussing.

MS BATOHI: Mr Cassim, you'd like this Commission to believe that you didn't know what was going on there, and that is why your statement is just so vague. It talks about forecasting, pitch reports, selection of teams. It doesn't go into any detail about who was saying what. You say in your statement: "I also heard them discussing team selection and who would be batting in which order." Now tell me what you heard about that, who would be batting in which order. Your statement says, 'I heard them' discussing this. Now what were they saying about that? MR CASSIM: It's very difficult to remember, but - it's difficult for me to remember, Adv Batohi. I know my statement says that, but I mean, the players - I don't even know which players were going to play and which were not playing. Hansie and him were discussing it. My ears were not 100% with them, but the little bit that I heard of I put it in my statement.

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