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Cassim's June 26 testimony

MR CASSIM: I spoke to Mr Cronjé a couple of times while he was in Dubai. I had a few friends who were going down to - who told me they were going down to watch the Sharjah Cup and if I could arrange a few tickets for them, and I contacted Hansie if he could give me a few tickets for the match.

MR WITZ: And in regard to the games, if I can go back one step, the games that were played in India, did you ever speak to any of the South African players, in particular relating to the question of tickets? Who requested tickets and who did you speak to to arrange tickets and for whom, please?

MR CASSIM: I spoke to Lance Klusener, I spoke to Hansie. Regarding Lance Klusener I needed tickets for the actress, Amisha Patel. She and her brother wanted to go and watch the One-day, it was a test match I think in Bombay that they needed tickets for and I arranged tickets with Lance Klusener.

MR WITZ: That's the very attractive young lady of whom you have a picture with, when she was here in South Africa, is that the same person?

MR CASSIM: Yes....

MR WITZ: Now just tell the Commissioner what is the secret, if there is any secret about speaking to a player in order to get tickets, why can't your friends or associates or people just go to the normal computicket or go to the normal ground and purchase a ticket? What type of tickets do you get from the player? What is the attraction of the tickets, if you can just tell us please?

MR CASSIM: The tickets you get from the players are under cover and it's in the grandstand, it's a very good ticket and it's very difficult to get tickets for the One-day matches so the players always have spare tickets, and knowing that I have the contact with the players a lot of my friends will come to me and say, "Banjo, please organise us tickets". And something I've learnt today is to say "no".

MR WITZ: Now Mr Cassim in regard to these tickets. You make the people aware your friends, associates, these actresses etc who actually the ticket is coming from that it's actually coming from a South African test player or an international player or would he just give it to them as a ticket? What do you tell them?

MR CASSIM: I would tell them from which player it comes from.

MR WITZ: Now I'd like to just turn to page 16 of your statement, which you have before you, and if we can just deal with paragraph 8.26. These are phone calls that you received from Sanjay asking you to contact Mr Cronjé. What did it appear to you, you were talking to both parties, what was the problem between Sanjay and Mr Cronjé? I understand this was at the time that the test match series and the One-day internationals....

MR CASSIM: He said "please get hold of Hansie. I need to speak to him". And it appeared to me that Sanjay was betting on the matches and he needed Hansie to assist him regarding forecasting and that.

MR WITZ: Is that the impression that you were placed under, that that was going on between the two of them?

MR CASSIM: That's correct.

MR WITZ: Now I'd like you to tell the Commissioner, what affect has this had on you, how do you now feel, especially in view of the, at times adverse publicity, that you introduced the gambler or punter, Sanjay, to the captain of the South African cricket team, and you now obviously, with hindsight, are aware that certain dealings went on between them? It is common cause he admitted that he took money from him and obviously there were further dealings, how has this affected you and how do you now feel?

MR CASSIM: It has affected me to a great extent, but nevertheless from a - a lot of the South African players have called me, they've given a lot of support to me, and in particular Herschelle Gibbs told me, "Hamid be strong. We know what type of a character you are". And to be honest it has affected me and I would love to still have that relationship and I will maintain a relationship with the players that I had.

MR WITZ: Now Mr Cassim the next aspect that hopefully we can put to rest, there's been suggestions, I think possibly from media speculation, I am not sure where it comes from or which source it comes from, suggestions that you are a betting man, either you are a bookmaker or a betting man. Just tell the Commissioner what is the position in regards to either being a bookmaker or a betting man or having any connections with such sources.

MR CASSIM: I want to make this clear to everybody. I am not a bookmaker, I have never placed a bet on a cricket match or any sporting activities. The last time I placed a bet was in 1976 and I got a hiding for that.

MR WITZ: Tell us what was that bet, was that on a sporting event, was it on a horse race, what was that bet about and what happened there, briefly please?

MR CASSIM: It was a horse race. I think it was Politician that was running and we had a food stall and this chap came to me and says, "let's take a bet" and I stole R50 from my brother and I placed the bet. And my brother came to find out and since then I have never ever placed a bet on a horse race or any sports matches in my entire life.

COMMISSIONER: Was it a winning bet?

MR CASSIM: Yes it was a winning bet, Politician won that race.

MR WITZ: Well that's normally where it starts, unfortunately if the first bet is a winning bet. But in any event what I'd like to just establish from you, I would like to just go back to the conversations that you had with Mr Cronjé and Sanjay in the room and either the telephonic conversations. Did it ever appear to you that in any way Mr Cronjé was trying to contrive a result, he was trying to fix a match? What was the impression that you were put under?

MR CASSIM: It appeared me that that never appeared to me that Mr Cronjé wanted to fix a match.

MR WITZ: In all your dealings and conversations, telephonically or face-to-face with Mr Cronjé, did it ever come across to you that he was speaking to other South African players in order not to perform to their abilities or in order not to do their best in any international series, One-day or test matches?

MR CASSIM: No.

MR WITZ: Now you yourself, from your own point of view, Mr Cassim, did you ever induce or encourage Mr Cronjé, or for that matter any other cricket player, local or international, to do anything that would be detrimental to the game of cricket or bring it into disrepute as far as you know the position?

MR CASSIM: No.

MR WITZ: It's also correct as per the correspondence that I read into the record from your attorney Mr Blumberg, that you contact the United Cricket Board already on the 13th of April and you offered them your full cooperation and assistance, is that correct?

MR CASSIM: Correct.

MR WITZ: Now just tell the Commissioner that you yourself personally, as you are sitting there today, have you ever had any dealings previously with the United Cricket Board, any incident that you can bring to mind, if you can assist the Commissioner please?

MR CASSIM: The only incident I had with the United Cricket Board, I think it was around about 1996 when India toured South Africa, I was standing outside the dressing room talking to Brian MacMillan's wife, Denise, and Denise wanted to get hold of Brian MacMillan so she said, "Hamid please see if you can call Brian for me". I used to call him "Big Mac". So I said okay, let me see if I can go inside. When I called Brian out of the dressing room, via the security chap there, Brian came out and there was a spectator standing right next to myself and Denise and he actually swore Brian. He said something very bad to Brian and I think if I wasn't standing there Brian would have half murdered that chap. Brian lifted him up and actually threw him against a vehicle, because he swore Brian's wife as well. And the UCB called me up for a hearing. That was the only confrontation I ever had with the UCB.

MR WITZ: Now what happened at this hearing? Was this an internal disciplinary hearing against Brian MacMillan or Big Mac as you referred to him?

MR CASSIM: That's correct.

MR WITZ: And did you have to give evidence at the United Cricket Board in relation to what you had heard, what had transpired and explain the position what happened between Mr MacMillan and this unruly or out of line spectator.

MR CASSIM: That's correct.

MR WITZ: What was the outcome, out of interest, as a result of the evidence that you gave, what did the United Cricket Board do in regard to this incident?

MR CASSIM: If my memory serves me correct I think Big Mac was fined.

MR WITZ: I'd like to just turn you to the last page of your statement before I deal with certain other aspects, this is page 17, and I'd like you to just read into the record, in particular the contents of paragraphs 13 and 14 just for record purposes.

MR CASSIM: Yes. 13 I have further undertaken via my legal representatives, Mr I W Blumberg and Advocate M Witz, to continue giving my full assistance and co-operation to the Commission. 14 I wish to reserve all my further rights in terms of the Constitution Act 108 of 1996 in regard to this statement including my rights to amend and/or amplify my statement if any further statements are made or received relating to the Commission of Inquiry against myself.

MR WITZ: Now besides the fact that you, from the very outset, have given your full cooperation and assistance and have undertaken to continue to do so, as I understand the position on legal advice from Mr Blumberg and myself, you requested that the last paragraph be put in, especially in view of late statements coming, documentation etc, and that was really the only reason why you put this in, to protect your Constitutional rights, is that correct Mr Cassim?

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