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Cronje's June 22 testimony

MR CRONJE: I wasn't surprised by the announcement, I was disappointed that Mr Cullinan didn't discuss it with me, but I could understand Mr Cullinan's disappointment, and I think I was part of it, and I think the national selectors were part of it, because it wasn't clearly communicated with Mr Cullinan as to what the reasons were for him not going to Kenya. I think his understanding was that he is a "has been" as far as the one day side is concerned, and the selectors wanted to look at the 2003 World Cup, and that's the impression that he got. It was partly to blame from my point of view and the selectors point of view. I don't believe the Centurion test match had anything to do with his decision, as his decision came before the Centurion decision was made anyway.

MS BATOHI: Did you at any stage suspect that Mr Cullinan might have known that you had taken R30 000 from Mr Aronstam at any stage during this game?

MR CRONJE: Mr Cullinan came to me with about 30 or 40 runs to go and he said to me "at least now I will have a beer with you, because I can see what your reason was behind declaring, I was very annoyed with you before that".

MS BATOHI: Once the Commission of Inquiry was announced, were you particularly worried about what Mr Cullinan was going to testify about at this Commission?

MR CRONJE: Mr Manthorpe was quoted as saying that Mr Cullinan had evidence of somebody handing me an envelope of money after the Centurion test match.

MS BATOHI: My question to you was were you concerned about what Mr Cullinan was going to say during these hearings?

MR CRONJE: I was concerned that Mr Cullinan thought that I got money for the Centurion test match, yes.

MS BATOHI: Well, you did receive R30 000 during that period from Mr Aronstam and R50 000?

MR CRONJE: I received R50 000.

MS BATOHI: Because Mr Aronstam will testify that during the conversations that he had with you, you often expressed concern to him about what, as you said, what Daryll was going to say. Is that you were concerned about?

MR CRONJE: Yes, Mr Aronstam also said to me that he had spoken to Mike Haysman and Mike Haysman had mentioned to him that there is whispers in the media that in fact the result at Centurion Park had nothing to do with cricket, but had more to do with the fact that Mr Aronstam had money on the game.

MS BATOHI: I am going to deal with the triangular series now.

COMMISSIONER: Before you do that, I have one or two questions I want to ask Mr Cronjé. Mr Aronstam, this is on Centurion match, Mr Aronstam was keen to, for you to make contact with the English captain, Nasser Hussain, and you said no, according to your statement, because you didn't want him to be involved. Involved in what?

MR CRONJE: If you make a declaration you try to leave it as late as possible. If you use your declaration as a surprise element, then you can actually use it to your advantage. Also if you tell the opposition that you've got the idea of declaring the night before, then they've got time to prepare for it and sleep on it. If you tell them the following morning then there is a good chance that they may have had a late night or they may have thought about fielding for the next day, so I didn't want to discuss that with him at all.

COMMISSIONER: But Mr Cronjé, he had to be involved, you couldn't have done the deal without the concurrence of Nasser Hussain?

MR CRONJE: I didn't want to speak to him the night before, I wanted to leave it as late as possible, to leave it as a surprise element, and that is why I only spoke to him the following morning, when we were doing the warm-ups.

COMMISSIONER: Did you tell Mr Aronstam that that was the reason why you didn't want to make contact with Nasser Hussain?

MR CRONJE: I cannot remember what reason I told Mr Aronstam.

COMMISSIONER: You see the use of the word "involved" suggests to me that it was an involvement that amounted in some way to collusion, to getting together to structure something, am I not right in that?

MR CRONJE: I told you Mr Aronstam was quite keen to make a game of it, ja.

COMMISSIONER: Can I accept that you knew that Mr Aronstam's keenness to make a game of it involved his wanting to either make bets or take bets on the outcome?

MR CRONJE: Yes, I think that Mr Arenstam wanted to make a bet on the game, yes.

COMMISSIONER: I mean was that clear to you at the time?

MR CRONJE: Yes.

COMMISSIONER: I will leave it at that for the moment.

MS BATOHI: Thank you Mr Commissioner. Mr Cronjé I am going to deal with your meeting with Mr Chawla. MR CRONJE: I have to correct you there, Ms Batohi, that in all the dealings that I have had with Sanjay, I have never been introduced or told that his surname is Chawla. I only know the man that I spoke to as Sanjay. I have not any other reason to believe that this is Sanjay Chawla, other than from what I have read in the media and seen in the press.

MS BATOHI: All right, we will refer to him as Sanjay then. COMMISSIONER: Perhaps at this point we could clear it up now, we have a possible maximum of four people involved here, there is Sanjay Chawla or Sanjay Chowla and there is Sanjeev Chawla or Sanjeev Chowla. Now what is the man's name, is it Sanjay - is Sanjay and Sanjeev the same, are they the same person?

MS BATOHI: Perhaps Mr Banjo Cassim would be able to assist on that at some stage, I am not entirely sure, Mr Commissioner.

COMMISSIONER: The man that you are talking about and that you are talking about, Mr Cronjé, we will call him Sanjay, that is how you knew him, is that right?

MR BLUMBERG: Mr Commissioner, to assist in this regard, my instructions are the man's name is Sanjay and there is only one individual, Sanjay.

COMMISSIONER: Sanjay what?

MR BLUMBERG: I don't know his surname.

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