'The other panelists (Praniti Shinde and Priyanka Chaturvedi) were misbehaving with me.'
'Despite that I kept quiet because I have witnessed many such scenes in the 25 years of my public life and debates.'
'Amid all the ruckus, when I heard Praniti calling me out for 'cheap behaviour' I couldn't take such misbehaviour anymore.'
Former Shiv Sena and Congress Rajya Sabha MP Sanjay Nirupam, who has now joined the Shiv Sena led by Chief Minister Eknath Shinde, explains why he got agitated during the India Today conclave debate where he had heated arguments with Shiv Sena Uddhav Balasaheb Thackeray's Rajya Sabha MP Priyanka Chaturvedi and the Congress's Solapur Lok Sabha MP Praniti Shinde.
The clip of the video (external link to X) where Nirupam is seen walking up to the anchor and the two women MPs has since gone viral on social media and Nirupam is being trolled for showing disrespect to women.
"I believe that in a democracy every individual has the right to express herself fearlessly and without being heckled. I believe in getting the same treatment when I am speaking," Nirupam tells Prasanna D Zore/Rediff.com.
What happened at the India Today conclave? You were seen leaving your seat and moving towards Priyanka Chaturvedi and Praniti Shinde and having a heated argument with them?
Nothing big happened. It was a debate and everybody wanted to express their views.
Wasn't it bad optics for you? Social media is abuzz that you were disrespecting the women MPs.
I did not show any disrespect towards anybody. My only contention was that I would rather walk out if some fellow panelist felt that my behaviour was 'cheap'. Is there anything wrong in what I said?
You were seen getting up from your seat and moving towards them...
No. That is not what happened.
That is what one can see in the video that has now gone viral on social media...
I was seated, but when there was a ruckus being created I went to the anchor (India Today editor Preeti Choudhry) and said 'If my behaviour is so cheap, I'd rather walk out.'
What upset you?
There was nothing much in what happened. I don't want to talk about it. I don't want to make it an issue.
It has already become an issue with many social media handles levelling the charge that you misbehaved with and disrespected Praniti Shinde and Priyanka Chaturvedi,
As I see it, we were having a debate and I was expressing my point which they were objecting to.
First, Priyanka Chaturvedi objected; she did not let me speak. Then the anchor asked me to sit next to Sahil (Joshi, one of the India Today editors who were on the dais) and I sat next to him.
After this, I was being called out for cheap behaviour to which I objected to because I did not indulge in any such behaviour.
On the contrary, I was being heckled when I was trying to put forth my views. If I was indulging in cheap behaviour, then I didn't deserve to be there. So, I decided that I should walk out.
For me it is not a big deal because such heated exchanges are quite normal and one has to understand that everybody on the stage is trying to express their views through such heated exchanges.
In a live democracy, each one of us has the right to freely express ourselves.
Do you regret that you should not have stood up from your seat and walked towards the anchor and the two MPs even as you made your point to walk out? This is what everybody is objecting to...
Is it written somewhere that I cannot stand up from my seat and speak to the anchor during a live debate?
If I am sitting across at some distance and I get to repetitively hear that my behaviour is cheap, then I have all the right to walk towards the anchor, who invited me to this debate, that I'd rather walk out if somebody has any problem with what I am saying.
One can clearly see in the video that first you walked towards the anchor and then towards Praniti Shinde and later towards Priyanka Chaturvedi and gesticulated at her even as you exchanged a few heated words with her... you looked quite worked up
If I were to keep repeatedly haranguing you that you are indulging in cheap behaviour, then you would also get worked up.
Wasn't this the first time you got so agitated and worked up during a live debate?
Let me apologise to you because you saw me so agitated during a debate for the first time.
Would you like to say anything to the two women MPs who felt that you misbehaved with them?
These things are routine. Mutual respect for each other is very important and I respect both Priyanka Chaturvedi and Praniti Shinde.
They should also respect their seniors and I have never ever insulted any woman. I strongly believe in respecting women. That is my culture, our culture, and I have breathed in that culture all my life.
During any debate there is limited time for every panelist in which he or she has to express their views. Having a heated argument is not tantamount to insulting somebody.
Do you regret that you should not have stood up from your seat and walked up to the two women MPs?
How can standing up from my seat be seen as disrespect for somebody?
If I stand up and walk towards the anchor because she was also sitting in that direction then how does it become disrespecting somebody.
Praniti toh mere liye beti ki tarah hai (Praniti is like a daughter to me).
Sushilkumar Shinde mere dost hai aur woh unki beti hai. Agar aap apne pitaji ki umr ki kisi vyakti ke liye kah rahi hai ki woh cheap behaviour hai toh woh mere liye sharmnak hai (Sushilkumar Shinde is my a friend and Praniti is his daughter. If you are charging someone your father's age that he is indulging in cheap behaviour then it is very shameful for me).
I was just expressing an argument and putting forth an argument in a debate cannot be equated with cheap behaviour.
When you were making your point and walked towards the anchor and Praniti Shinde, Priyanka Chaturvedi was heard telling you 'We all know how good your behaviour is', that you don't respect women and that your voice was raised and you were wagging your hands...
This kind of words can always be used (to malign somebody).
I didn't stop anybody from making their point. I was heckled while I was speaking.
If you are going to disallow me to speak then I am going to retaliate. Is this -- disallowing somebody from making his point -- not disrespect? Did I stop anybody from speaking? I didn't.
I believe that in a democracy every individual has the right to express herself fearlessly and without being heckled. I believe in getting the same treatment when I am speaking.
The two anchors, who were also visibly disturbed because of my heckling, are witness to it. Both the anchors were saying that I should be allowed to speak. Then I was asked to change my seat and sit next to Sahil Joshi, which I did without politely.
If you look at it objectivelym then I was being misbehaved with. When I am not allowed to speak up without being shouted at then I am being misbehaved with.
The other panelists (Shinde and Chaturvedi) were misbehaving with me. Despite that I kept quiet because I have witnessed many such scenes in the 25 years of my public life and debates.
You can put forward your point, and then you can either agree or disagree with my point of view and put forward your arguments, but why should I not be allowed to speak without any heckling?
I was already hurt with this behaviour. To top it all, amid all the ruckus, when I heard Praniti calling me out for 'cheap behaviour' I couldn't take such misbehaviour anymore and couldn't hold myself back.
I then decided to stand up, walk up to the anchor and told her that I'd rather walk out of the debate.
My point was if they thought I was indulging in cheap behaviour then I didn't deserve to be there. I should walk out from there.
Do you regret that whatever happened during that debate should not have happened the way it happened?
India is a democratic country and in this democratic set up everybody has the right to express their views freely. When each one of us express our views passionately such sparks are only natural to fly. We must accept it gracefully.
Was your behaviour graceful to walk up to the anchor, to the two women MPs and say that you would rather walk out?
You are now trying to act smart as well as speak like a fool.
I have already told you at least three times that I walked up to the anchor. Is it a sin or crime to stand up from one's seat and walk towards the anchor? Was I going to attack anybody?
So, you don't think that you charged at them?
I have told you more than 10 times now I stood up and walked up towards the anchor to tell her that I was feeling like walking out if somebody felt that my behaviour was cheap.
But you have been asking me the same question again and again. What's the point of asking me the same question again and again? Do you have an agenda?
Will I not lose my temper, if you ask me the same question sixth time, after having already answered the same question five times before? I am also a human being. I am not god.
What's the point of so much heckling?
I have myself worked as a journalist for 25 years; I have edited a very popular newspaper (Dopahar Ka Saamna). I would never heckle anybody.
You have a right to ask question. You must ask questions. That is the duty of a journalist. My duty is to answer your questions.
To end this interview, let me reiterate my points:
- I take it gracefully when heated debates take place. That is not a big deal.
- I believe in respecting women and I have always respected women.
- I was being intimidated by the two women MP fellow panelists
- When I was being heckled and asked to take another seat I did that politely, but after that when I was charged with 'cheap behaviour' I got hurt.
I have a right to get hurt and at that very moment I got up from my seat, walked up to the anchor and told her that I would rather leave the debate if somebody felt my behaviour is cheap and I don't deserve to be on the stage.
Did you speak with Praniti Shinde and Priyanka Chaturvedi after the debate got over?
No. I was very hungry so I went straight to eat food. And since it were raining heavily and I was worried it would take me another 90 minutes to reach home; I decided to go home and have my food.
