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January 14, 1999
SPECIALS
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'98% of Hindus couldn't care less about the RSS-VHP'
How Readers reacted to Varsha Bhosle's recent columns
Date sent: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 13:05:28 +0300
I am a relatively new visitor to Rediff, and I have just finished reading Varsha Bhosle's latest article. I myself am proud of saying I am a Hindu. But the display of religious machoism all over India by all religious bodies belies the fact that India is a secular country. I do not believe in secularism. Neither do I believe in Talibanisation. With the level of illiteracy and poverty prevailing in the country, it is easy for rabble-rousers to hijack the masses with religious babble. And it is all very well to criticise the Leftist or the Rightist tendencies among our politicians, but we are the ones who elected them. How many politicians are there in the country any way -- 10,000, 20,000, a million? And we let this handful of people guide the destiny of 9.5 billion? We have to stand up and get counted -- being armchair critics of all that is bad about the country is useless. Fifty years after Independence, a revolution is required to wake the sleeping giant that our country is.
Date sent: Thu, 7 Jan 1999 23:46:24 -0800 (PST)
In an earlier posting on Bhosle's columns, I had said that we need a data-based analysis of the monetary values of concessions exclusively given to different communities. Varsha Bhosle responded with "You likeee stats?..." and went on to give a few selected figures. Well, me never said me likeee stats. Madam, there is a difference between mere stats and stats-based analysis, and it is not even a subtle one to those who are familiar with research. What one needs is an indepth analysis which is not something that can be done overnight. Anyone with contacts can get a couple of suitably selected stats on government spending. But for a scholarly data-based analysis, one needs to examine the various types of expenditure incurred that can be regarded as being exclusive concessions to communities. For example, if there are places of pilgrimage in remote/urban areas, then one needs to take into account the amount the government has spent to make access/stay easy (by laying down railway tracks, related installations, communications). If concessions in the form of quotas are given to weaker sections of some communities, then these should be accounted for by factoring in the proportion of population of the communities. Just investigating possible factors in a comprehensive manner can be a major task in itself. So, Varshaji, don't take it upon yourself to do the data-based analysis. Leave it to the researchers in the field. Even if a biased researcher starts working on it, it would be worthwhile. It would get others to think about it.
Date sent: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 20:33:42 -0800
Crime is crime and it must get punishment as per the law. I am not talking about that. The outburst of Varsha and a lot of other people who are bent on proving their "secular" credentials, need be faced with the following questions: 1. Have they considered the circumstances that have led to this condition? For example, do they know what atrocities have been committed by the missionaries on the tribals? If they have, is it not fair to mention that at least? 2. What is the cost of this hue and cry? Have we not seen what happened in Ayodhya? A temple was razed and a mosque created on that place. There was enough proof of that. 3. Why are we talking about only the bad things in Hinduism? Is this religion devoid of merit? Why don't our secular vocalists care to talk about the positive things of these religions? Are there no contexts for such talks? Also, is only the RSS responsible to cure Hinduism of its ills? 4. Is it justified to cite the ills of Hinduism as enough reason to allow conversion (I am not talking about conversions which happen by way of will). Today Indian industries are not in good shape, for whatever reasons. Is it OK to allow MNCs to kill them (they can, easily, if they are allowed) or is it better to let the local industries become stronger and then put them through full competition? It is very easy to put certain facts that are in line with happenings and make an impressive speech because it is in sync with current emotions. To make a balanced statement, one needs to do more homework. Not many people are ready to do that. Hindu-bashing has paid off for long time. We have to stop this. In America, the same thing has been happening with whites. The bashing of whites has been paying dividend for a long time. Now it is changing, at least, in California. Devendra Tripathi
Date sent: Thu, 7 Jan 1999 20:47:35 -0600
Enough bouquets and brickbats have headed your way already, as the earlier postings testify. My 2 cents: I like your forthright way of airing views, and agree fundamentally with some of them. It's true that the 'secular' Congress is so just to keep itself in the running for power, but the RSS-VHP is an even greater danger to our country. I am opposed to sops for certain groups of people (eg, that people from different religions are governed by different laws), but the way this bunch of moronic hooligans has reacted to it is disgusting. India, sadly, is now seeing another Taliban entity arise within it. The fact that 98% of Hindus couldn't care less about the RSS-VHP combine is obscured by the fact that almost all people in India prefer to be silent spectators to anything not involving them; the 'jaane de yaar, apna kyaa lena-dena' attitude. Hence the fact that a bunch of goondas are running about dictating lifestyle to everyone, and pushing us back into the middle ages. And the truth is, that the sops these guys are complaining about (and which I mentioned earlier) have been created by HINDU politicians in search of vote banks, and not the fault of recipient communities. In any case, I digress. The point which I am meandering towards is, your views (to me, at least) are reasonably sound. Please couch them in sensible, logical terms, so that they may better appeal to sensible, logical people, and not risk conveying the impression that your article are just emotional outbursts.
Date sent: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 02:21:30 PST
Well, we see that when Hindus talk to the missionaries in the language they can understand all kinds of talkative intellectuals come to their rescue. The Gujarat government and the Hindu Jagran Manch are doing the right thing by stopping conversions at all cost. We have seen the result of Christian missionaries creating Christian majority states in the north-east, it leads to the terrorisation of the "infidel" Hindus there. All Vajpayee is good at is making speeches. Even now as in the time of the nuclear blasts last May, Vajpayee cannot forcefully tell the world India's reasons behind the events. Instead he just starts going on the defensive. Bhima Patel
Date sent: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 13:34:02 CST
I got a personal mail from one of VB's stupid fans in response to my earlier mail. This gentleman (??!!) actually reflected on his upbringing showing an altogether rotten state of mind, revealing the hypocrisy in his heart. He posed some idiotic questions and expected me to answer him. I would definitely answer questions with a clear intention, asked to seek the truth, not questions with malice, and hatred and that keep such guys wandering in their dreams that they can change the state of affairs of India by bashing helpless minorities at their will. Cut the crap, VB. You always try to confuse the issue for all your muddle-headed fans to lap up and yap for more. In a previous article, you had said Bombay (the movie) was taken off movie-houses because of "Muslim protests", and when someone points out that that is a lie, you abuse him, giving some convoluted logic that does not prove you did not lie, but sure makes it look that way. You say the Hindu tax-payer pays Rs 12,000 per Muslim who goes for the Haj. Do you even know what the round trip fare to Jeddah is, and what the pilgrim pays? That "subsidy", even if correct, comes to about 10% of the total cost, which even for 5,000 pilgrims comes to 60 million rupees. You say 60 million rupees subsidy for 150,000,000 people is too much? And what about the expense incurred when the government has to make security arrangements for Hindus to go Amarnath, Badrinath, Somnath, Baidyanath, Prannath, and what not? What about the "camps" that have to be set up, maintained, and guarded? What about the medical assistance that has to be provided? And what about the loss due to inconvenience, damage, and upkeep costs caused to the government when Hindus install huge idols of Ganesh, Kali, Durga and what not in every town and city in the country? And then the loss due to pollution when they go and immerse these idols in the nearest lake or pond? Do you think you are serving the cause of your own people (Hindus) by inciting them with all this false propaganda against Muslims? What about the TAX that Muslims pay, which is spent on the police force? Don't you know that when even a weak person is totally cornered and trapped by a bully, he will hit out? And he might go down, but will take a lot away from the damned bully when he does?
Date sent: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 17:06:30 -0500
Crap. I sometimes wonder how Rediff can publish articles from Vir Sanghvi, which are thought-provoking, and from Varsha B. Please inform Varsha that a good writer never uses the retaliation method to answer reader's mail. It's pretty bad in taste.
Sanjay Sahay
Date sent: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 15:34:21 -0500
Dear Varshaji, Before I start could you please inform me as to what other newspapers you write for? It is very upsetting to know that the media and information world that is controlled by Leftist fanatics, are all out to suppress free flow of ideas and expression. And they call themselves secularist, yeah right! They are nothing but pseudo-secularists/phony liberalists and alumni of the JNU where Leftism is the only religion. In fact, I was thinking that the Indian dictionaries should now change the meaning of secularism itself. The new meaning should be: "Appeasement of minorities in India at the cost/expense of majority". This is exactly what the word has been used for in the press. What else can you expect of these "Brown Sahibs" in India, who wear a hat of Western education and start their monkey act of kissing Western ideologies. For them, the Italian is a god-sent avatar; white skin, with beauty and brains, a complete package made to rule India. According to these pseudo-secularists, the only fit person to be the premier of India has to be either a foreigner or a dalit, period. No one else can ever be fit for the job. For them Hindutva/Hinduism is synonymous with brahminism/casteism/oppression/suppresion etc. They suffer from this strange "H" word syndrome. They are so phobic to this word and its history that a mere utterance of this word sends shock waves through their entire cerebral/nervous system. BTW, you article, Dear Readers 2, was excellent. Just like the previous one. One of the comments that really made me laugh, was: "Religion should be practised in your own house. Don't impose your likes or dislikes on the society." Of course, you gave a befitting reply to this: "I agree absolutely. Which is why I oppose namaaz on the streets, azaans on loudspeakers and state-funding for religious junkets." Such pseudo-secularists should be answered in the tone they themselves talk. One comment was, that brahminism/casteism exists because of Hinduism. Your answer again was to the point and in the manner it should have been answered to that person, i e wherever there is man, there is social class. Don't blame Hinduism for it. You said it!!! After reading these comments, it is so easy to see, how the media has done its job of misinforming the people of India. Half of them spoke of things they heard or was printed in the newspapers by these pseudo-secularists. I am amazed to know some facts myself! I did not have a clue as to the exact amount the government of India spends in sending these Muslims to Mecca. Thank you very much, Varshaji, for coming out with these facts. And about the tenancy act for Muslim trusts, this is shear injustice!!! It just shows how stupid the intelligentsia of India is. We defend those who are out to destroy us, while those who are out defend our country, its culture, its heritage, its dignity and respect are called fundamentalists/ communal etc. What a marvellous job these self-styled "secularists" have done in misinforming the country and its people. These are the real enemies of India. People who twist and turn the facts to give it a communal bias before presenting it to the people. These are the people who will report that there was a clash between two communities, without informing us which communities, lest people get informed of which community is out creating trouble in India. These people like to bake the truth the way they want, along with their own ingredients, and then they present it to us so that we think and decide what they want us to! Moreover, they just like to indulge in sensationalism without presenting facts. And they call themselves free and unbiased press! One example is about the ongoing controversy regarding the dismissal of Admiral Bhagwat from the navy. They have been trying their level best to present us the truth in the way they want us to think. Why don't they write about the entire petition filed by Vice-Admiral Harinder Singh in the court against Bhagwat? They just tell us half-truths, that the government sacked Admiral Bhagwat and the government is the real culprit who is out to control everything the way they want. Even Amberish Diwanji of Rediff is involved in this. They write that the government left no way out for Admiral Bhagwat knowing that his wife is an advocate. Well, then why don't they go ahead and write: what her name is, what were her previous cases like, for example during the 1992-93 riots who she was defending, what was Bhagwat's recommendation, who was recommended etc? Varshaji, why don't you write on this case? It will be really nice to let the people know how these pseudo-secularists manipulate news. Even on Rediff I am able to see, a not so holy nexus between D'Souza, D'Monte, Diwanji, Sivaswamy and the like. Even the governments of India has done a fine job of appeasing Muslims, and Christians. It is only in India you will see state/national governments saying, "We'll give protection to Christians", "We'll give protection to Muslims" but never have I ever in my entire life seen a statement saying, "We'll give protection to Hindus", be it in India or else outside India, in any part of the world. Why are Hindus being treated this way, in their own homeland? Why are they being regarded as step-children of India? Why such bias against them, in the government as well as the media? When will all theses lies stop? Christians are out to convert using, Moh, Maya and Krodh. Muslims are out to convert or else destroy the "kafirs" using any or all means. Then how come Hindus have never been promised any protection in India?!! When will the government start funding Sanskrit schools in India the same way it funds Urdu schools? When will the government start funding the pilgrimages for Hindus, just the way they fund trips to Mecca for Muslims? When will the journalists/columnists of Indian press/media start reporting plain facts, a job they are supposed to do and stop creating opinions or guiding them? When will we see such a revolution in India??? A True Indian, Sanjay
Date sent: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 20:25:01 EST
Excellent Varsha. Keep it up! Best wishes. Vasu
Date sent: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 13:33:40 -0500
If Rediff is interested in maintaining its present popularity as a credible Indian website it should immediately stop publishing the trash Varsha Bhosle regularly spews out. In her latest column she takes potshots at the grammar and English of her readers and their comments on her. Presumably she seems to suffer from illusions about her English, and in any case it is these very readers who happen to provide her bread and butter. PS: I challenge Bhosle to attempt ripping this piece for its style, grammar, and English.
Date sent: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 13:31:21 -0500 (EST)
Varsha Bhosle is the only columnist on Rediff who I disagree with almost always, yet I enjoy practically all the time. Must be something about her, I think it's her style. Anyway, having said that, I'd like to say what I didn't like about this particular column. It's not really a problem with the content -- that's nothing any regular on SCI has not read a gazillion times before. It's all so played out. The problem is with her rebuttals of this anonymous reader. They're not very, umm, good. While I do see her point, I fear I may be in a minority. For example, the readers complaint about the excessive use of quotations. I have to agree -- too many quotations do tend to obfuscate the columnist's own argument. And sometimes, and this is *my* pet gripe, I get the feeling some of her columns don't have an argument -- they just drift from one issue to the other, the end having nothing to do with the beginning. Maybe I'm just too dense to grasp the literary value of her columns, who knows. But chances are if I'm not "getting it," there might be quite a few other readers out there who ain't getting it either. You see what I'm saying? Moving on. Varsha says, "If I've given it a communal angle, why would it enthuse liberals?". Fact of the matter is, the reader never said it would. Enthuse the libbies, that is. This is what I mean by a bad rebuttal. But of course, there's more. There almost always is. She goes on to ask what the "issue" is -- and says, "Is it freedom of expression and choice? Or is it just the lynching of the "rightist nitwits"...? How the slips show...". One wonders what slips she is talking about? Reader Mahoday never said anything about lynching right-wingers. So where exactly is she getting this accusation from? Moving on, finally -- a gem of an argument from Varsha. The rebuttal to the readers comment on Bombay and the controversy surrounding it is simple and accurate. But of course, nothing lasts forever, and she quickly moves on to say, "BTW, how come you ignore the fact that Rushdie's The Moor's Last Sigh is freely available in Saffron Maharashtra? Or can't you absorb that which could make you think...?" This rebuttal stinks. My opinion, of course. And let me tell you why I have this opinion. Let's say, hypothetically speaking, I write a paper denigrating the Muslims of Dhaka for the post-Babri riots there. Of course, one of their people can very easily stand up, and take a cue from Varsha, and say -- "BTW, how come you ignore the fact that Hindus demolished Babri Masjid, etc." Believe me, they will come up with a long litany of "crimes" perpetrated by us on them. What exactly is my point, you ask? The fact that party A perpetrated a crime on party B does not validate the crime by B on A. Now, you may not agree with that, and if you don't, consider this. Is it true, that when an individual speaks up on crimes by A on B, (s) he must also mention crimes by B on A? If that were the case, then nothing would be done -- we'd all be stuck writing forever, because the list of crimes perpetrated by people on people is close to infinite. Moving on, the next part of her column is well thought out. Her comments on religion being a private matter, on the existence of class divisions within Muslim society, are very impressive. They address the point, and they are, to my knowledge, true. No complaints here. But hey, didn't I say nothing lasts forever? Well, here's proof. She asks, "Or, does fanaticism not exist among Mosies?" The reader never said it didn't, did (s)he? Again, Varsha is putting words in the reader's mouth - words he never said. Let me say this as simply as I can, and this is addressed to all the Hindu Rightists out there: **To point out Hindu fanaticism does not implicitly mean one denies Muslim fanaticism.** It's as simple as that. She ends with a flourish. Great ending. Great argument. Overall, good column. But it could really do without the logical atrocities and bad reasoning which is sprinkled a little too liberally throughout it. One request, though -- don't ever leave Rediff. Abhijit
Date sent: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 18:20:03 PST
Excellent rebuff. Your hate mail writers actually hate your guts and your logic. As truth surfaces gradually, haters will disappear steadily. Keep it up. I admire you because you are the only lady columnist with a spine.
Prabir Roy
Date sent: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 11:11:36 -0500
GREAT!!
Date sent: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 14:49 -0500 (EST)
Fantastic Varsha. I hope to see more like you on this site and less of Dilip's breed. A fitting answer to all those who sit on a high chair & comment on communalism of BJP/RSS/SS, do not know the actual situation and just get a one-sided picture... Can you write something on the FORCED conversions that happen with facts to keep quite these morons? Milind
Date sent: Tue, 5 Jan 1999 09:48:52 -0500
Hey Varsha! You have this 'fire' in you that is quite noticeable in your articles. I know you are quite angry with the whole freaking country. Me too! But don't aggravate the omnipresent bitterness between the Hindus and the 'Muslims'. Don't call them 'Mosies' or any such adjective. Take care. Anoop
Date sent: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 08:21:39 -0500
Attagirl, Varsha! That's showing them. Keep up the good work, dear. As I have said before, you are the MAN! Pradeep |
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